WMC vs Other DVRs

[barnabas1969]

As far as expandability of storage being a deciding feature of WMC, I have never understood this. My WMC system had 230 ripped movies and at any given time 100-200 SD TV show recordings, plus all my music, photos, and home videos, and I don't think it ever amounted to 1 TB. My DirecTV HR44 Genie has 1TB of storage and I don't think I have ever seen it more than 40% full. It's like folks that have 20,000+ photos stored on their computer -- when will you ever be able to consume that much content? Are you storing 3TB of TV shows just because you can?

Bolded two key points to your answer. HD has at least 6x the pixels/sec of SD, and similarly probably 6x the bitrate. In addition to that, you are recording from DirecTV, which like most Satellite or European TV providers uses H.264 exclusively. Most cable companies in the US transmit only using MPEG-2. To get the same quality as an H.264 stream, the MPEG-2 stream would need to have at least double the bitrate. (and that's in the best case that there is practically no action). DivX, which is a subset of H.264 with a few features removed for easier playback, claims it is 11x the compression efficiency of MPEG-2. For fast action scenes this actually seems about right. For a general case instead of just action scenes, I would guess the normal is probably about 5x. So an hour of HD from a normal cable company is going to take 5x the space of an HD recording from DirecTV. I have many 1 hour recordings from FIOS that are around 8GB each.

I have 4TB of storage. I schedule every new series that looks even remotely interesting, and every series from the previous year that I find interesting.

When the "TV season" is over, I still have lots of episodes that I haven't watched yet, and I watch them during the "off-season".

I don't cancel my cable subscription during the "off-season", mostly because there are some cable-only shows that only play new episodes during the off-season.

I also never watch standard definition unless that is the only choice... which is very rare in my channel lineup.

[adam1991]

I suppose the same question could be asked about people who have a programmable thermostat, but never invest the 10 minutes required to program it.

Oh, that's right--you're no longer married.

Not that it's any of your business

You're 100% right, it's not. It was intended to be a funny comment. To be fair, I debated whether or not to use a smiley. I went with "no". Maybe I should have.

I *am* married, and I've tried like hell to use the programmable thermostat. Guess what. I might as well try to move the earth from its orbit using a crowbar.

[dellybelly]

I have a Filtrete WiFi thermostat; it actually makes the process easy as cake (after the admittedly annoying setup). Nothing like having access to your thermostat on your phone in real time. It was the first thing I bought we we moved into our house and it's worked wonderfully. Think I got it for $79 like 5 years ago; even have it hooked up to my sony dash so I can adjust in bed if needed.

[IownFIVEechos]

The COOL thing about the NEST is that Google now owns them and from what I read they want to incorporate it into a network. That means you will not need to know how to program it. The network will know what your neighbors are doing and it can set it to how they are using it. At first I thought here we go again with Google/Privacy but at the end of the day it seems like a sweet idea, I WARMED up to the idea.

[mike_ekim]

If you are at work and someone mentions a show you want to watch, you can program your DVR with your phone or computer, and you don't need to be your own tech support and it doesn't take 2 months of research to set it up. Amazing.

This is equally possible today for WMC through Ceton's My Media Center smart phone app, http://cetoncorp.com/products/companion/.

True, but that requires 3rd party (paid) software, or some other free software that may not be as easy to set up. If someone looks up a whole-home DVR system, this capability will listed front and center. Anyone who researches WMC features will have to do some digging to even discover this capability exists for WMC. When I started researching WMC I compared WMC's features (not the paid 3rd party app's features) to XBMC, Media Portal, etc.

See this other part of my post.

I think the new whole-home systems with multi-device support are awesome. If you are at work and someone mentions a show you want to watch, you can program your DVR with your phone or computer, and you don't need to be your own tech support and it doesn't take 2 months of research to set it up. Amazing. Two points (for me):

[barnabas1969]

If you are at work and someone mentions a show you want to watch, you can program your DVR with your phone or computer, and you don't need to be your own tech support and it doesn't take 2 months of research to set it up. Amazing.

This is equally possible today for WMC through Ceton's My Media Center smart phone app, http://cetoncorp.com/products/companion/.

True, but that requires 3rd party (paid) software, or some other free software that may not be as easy to set up. If someone looks up a whole-home DVR system, this capability will listed front and center. Anyone who researches WMC features will have to do some digging to even discover this capability exists for WMC. When I started researching WMC I compared WMC's features (not the paid 3rd party app's features) to XBMC, Media Portal, etc.

See this other part of my post.

I think the new whole-home systems with multi-device support are awesome. If you are at work and someone mentions a show you want to watch, you can program your DVR with your phone or computer, and you don't need to be your own tech support and it doesn't take 2 months of research to set it up. Amazing. Two points (for me):

I don't know about your TV provider, but I can attest that using mine (Brighthouse) is a terrible experience. I used to have their DVR, and they had an online/mobile app. It took more than 60 seconds to schedule a single recording... and it failed about 66% of the time. Granted, that was before I got into Windows Media Center in 2011... but that was only 3 years ago. Their online/mobile app SHOULD have been working... technology in 2011 was advanced enough to support such a simple thing.

On balance, I can use My Media Center to schedule a recording in seconds... from anywhere.

[mike_ekim]

I don't know about your TV provider, but I can attest that using mine (Brighthouse) is a terrible experience. I used to have their DVR, and they had an online/mobile app. It took more than 60 seconds to schedule a single recording... and it failed about 66% of the time. Granted, that was before I got into Windows Media Center in 2011... but that was only 3 years ago. Their online/mobile app SHOULD have been working... technology in 2011 was advanced enough to support such a simple thing.

On balance, I can use My Media Center to schedule a recording in seconds... from anywhere.

That's a valid point on it's own, but that's missing my point (important only because you responded to my post). You're saying that your WMC setup with 3rd party add ons is better than your cable provider's DVR. So is mine! With research, effort and patience it can happen. I'm glad I put the effort into my WMC setup. But then again, I still have cable.

My point is that when someone researches HTPC software, the stock WMC features just don't stack up to other software, especially for cord cutters, and people will just pick another HTPC software before they learn more about WMC and it's third party apps. I don't blame them. I think that's the reason we are a dying breed.

[barnabas1969]

When you have copy-protected content from your cable provider, Media Center is the only viable option, unless you want to have a bunch of HD-PVR's and STB's stacked up.

[slowbiscuit]

Yep that point quickly gets overlooked/ignored when folks gush about how everything else is better.

[lithium630]

I hate to say it, but I switched to Dish last October and it's been fantastic. We had a lot of snow this winter and I only had to clean the dish off one time. It's mounted to a pole on the ground so no big deal. The sling function works great. The limited tuners can be an issue once in a while, but a new Joey (extender) is supposed to be out this year which adds two more tuners. It has some crappy apps but I hope they add more. I would love to see them add Netflix but I don't see it happening.

[barnabas1969]

I hate to say it, but I switched to Dish last October and it's been fantastic. We had a lot of snow this winter and I only had to clean the dish off one time. It's mounted to a pole on the ground so no big deal. The sling function works great. The limited tuners can be an issue once in a while, but a new Joey (extender) is supposed to be out this year which adds two more tuners. It has some crappy apps but I hope they add more. I would love to see them add Netflix but I don't see it happening.

Wow, that sounds like a glowing endorsement! Crappy apps, not enough tuners, and weather conditions can affect your signal. Sign me up, Scotty!

Try living in a sub-tropical climate where rain falls in buckets, and clouds can extend from (almost) ground level up to many thousands of feet above sea level. Everyone I know who has satellite here in Florida is unhappy with the fact that their service is so frequently interrupted by the weather. In fact, I'll take it further (who knew?)... besides folks who live so far out in the sticks that they can't get cable TV, the ONLY people I know who switched to satellite did so for financial reasons... and almost all of them switched back after their contract was up!

Oh... and I forgot to mention... the cable provider in my area (Brighthouse) has no contracts. They also have a money-back guarantee... if you don't like their service after 30 days, it won't cost you a dime. They will refund the entire cost, including all up-front costs (which includes running new cables to the rooms in your house).

And... even after the first 30 days, if a service tech shows up late to their 2-hour appointment window, the service call is free. They charge less to run a coax to any room in your house than it would often cost for the coax itself. Each drop is $25, no matter what. It's not even worth crawling through the attic for 25 bucks!

U-Verse is available in my area, but they have a limit on how many shows an entire household can watch/record! The limit depends... in most places it's 2 HD shows, plus 2 SD shows. In other places it's 4 HD shows, plus 2 SD shows. That's a household limit. And, when you're using all of your video services, it affects your Internet speed. I don't watch SD anything anymore... so I couldn't live with that limit.

[mike_ekim]

Yep that point quickly gets overlooked/ignored when folks gush about how everything else is better.

I don't think it's overlooked or ignored. I think it's just irrelevant for cord cutters, and there are a lot of cord cutters. I have cable so I use WMC. If I didn't have cable or sat, I would not use WMC.

I think default WMC looks better than other PVRs, especially for recorded cable TV/Movies (Plex on Roku is the only think with a better default appearance IMO), and WMC is dead simple to set up including guide data and tuners; but without cable TV WMC would just be a launcher for Netflix and home movies.

[slowbiscuit]

Well yeah that's kind of obvious. The bottom line is that WMC is really the only viable option for a lot of folks on cable using HTPCs, and I'd bet the major pop using it are not cord cutters. So it's cool to say that WMC doesn't compare well to the alternatives if you assume there are plenty of them, but there's not.

[mike_ekim]

Well yeah that's kind of obvious. The bottom line is that WMC is really the only viable option for a lot of folks on cable, and I'd bet the major pop using it are not cord cutters. So it's cool to say that WMC doesn't compare well to the alternatives if you assume that unicorns exist.

It's kind of obvious, yet every time it gets mentioned in this thread someone finds a way to write a disagreeable response. Was the purpose of this thread not to discuss the huge number of discussions of WMC vs other software, and how WMC has lost popularity?

[Dkeyguy1]

Granted my system is a little over the top, I originally started down the MC road because it took 5 minutes to determine which remote to use and figure out if the batteries were dead or it was on the wrong setting.
My main box has 3D Blu-ray(Total Media Theater), Playon, Amazon, Revision3, Recorded TVHD, etc., 2 Ceton InfiniTV4s, 1 Avermedia Duet(ATSC), 17 TB of storage, blah, blah, blah,..... 1 Microsoft MCE remote.
Thanks to Windows 7 and Ceton the TV is now HD through the cable. Cable company DVR, firewire, and seriously small storage drives(XP MCE) are Thankfully a thing of the past.
I have 1 remote, I can do anything I like through MC, and have fully capable extenders.... Windows Media Center was supposed to provide a central place to expand from, add functionality.
You can pay for it with your own software/hardware, or you can subscribe to pay for someone else's. I like mine. I have 6 CableCards paired to tuners I can move where I want. I can add as much storage as I want.
The main big box works as client, server, and main DVR. Oh yeah, Media Browser 3 is currently a part of the environment as well. My Media Center......

[lithium630]

I hate to say it, but I switched to Dish last October and it's been fantastic. We had a lot of snow this winter and I only had to clean the dish off one time. It's mounted to a pole on the ground so no big deal. The sling function works great. The limited tuners can be an issue once in a while, but a new Joey (extender) is supposed to be out this year which adds two more tuners. It has some crappy apps but I hope they add more. I would love to see them add Netflix but I don't see it happening.

Wow, that sounds like a glowing endorsement! Crappy apps, not enough tuners, and weather conditions can affect your signal. Sign me up, Scotty!

Try living in a sub-tropical climate where rain falls in buckets, and clouds can extend from (almost) ground level up to many thousands of feet above sea level. Everyone I know who has satellite here in Florida is unhappy with the fact that their service is so frequently interrupted by the weather. In fact, I'll take it further (who knew?)... besides folks who live so far out in the sticks that they can't get cable TV, the ONLY people I know who switched to satellite did so for financial reasons... and almost all of them switched back after their contract was up!

Oh... and I forgot to mention... the cable provider in my area (Brighthouse) has no contracts. They also have a money-back guarantee... if you don't like their service after 30 days, it won't cost you a dime. They will refund the entire cost, including all up-front costs (which includes running new cables to the rooms in your house).

And... even after the first 30 days, if a service tech shows up late to their 2-hour appointment window, the service call is free. They charge less to run a coax to any room in your house than it would often cost for the coax itself. Each drop is $25, no matter what. It's not even worth crawling through the attic for 25 bucks!

U-Verse is available in my area, but they have a limit on how many shows an entire household can watch/record! The limit depends... in most places it's 2 HD shows, plus 2 SD shows. In other places it's 4 HD shows, plus 2 SD shows. That's a household limit. And, when you're using all of your video services, it affects your Internet speed. I don't watch SD anything anymore... so I couldn't live with that limit.

There are very few apps for Media Center, and the ones available are more hacks than anything. That's probably a wash. On Demand content goes to dish. Tuners go to Media Center. Sling function goes to Dish. You can also send shows right to your phone or tablet to watch offline. Reliability goes to Dish. Plus it's great for the WAF. If something should break, it's Dish's fault not mine.

I have Brighthouse at my vacation home in Davenport and I'm not impressed. I agree about running the coax. I have no urge to climb into a Flordia attic with all the creepy crawlies to save $25.

[EZEd]

Here comes a novel...

I originally started out with WMC back in the WinXP days. Prior to that I had a PC with a tuner card and Win98. It worked but there were hardly any 10ft UIs back then so it was all separate apps between TV, music and viewing pictures. Officially I never did build a WinXP MCE box because I tried so many other UIs that I never got around to getting a copy of XP MCE. It was going to be my next step but then Vista came out and decided to get it instead. This was back when the only way to get digital cable on the PC was an OEM provided box with the ATI tuner. I couldn't afford that so I used OTA tuners (ATSC & NTSC and analog cable).

So the motivation to use a PC was that I didn't want to pay for the cableco DVR box anymore. I just wanted an OTA DVR for ATSC signals. I think at the time Sony still made one, maybe Panasonic and Magnavox had one...but that was it. ReplayTV was threatening to go out of business and TiVo was just as expensive for OTA as the cableco DVR (with subscription) so that wasn't going to save me anything.

I looked at BeyondTV, SageTV, VistaMC and Nero had a 10 ft UI out called TVSuite I believe, JRiverMC, Media Portal and GBPVR. I settled on VistaMC because it was the easiest to set up and get going at the time. I believe Vista & Sage were the only two that had hardware extenders at the time as well and there was still hope during those days that Microsoft would release Softsled as Sage had done with its software extender. There also came along later rumors that cablecard would eventually make it to the DIY PC market so that helped me to further commit to the Microsoft ecosystem.

So here we are some 8 to 12 years later and you still just can't walk into Walmart, buy a cablecard based HDTV DVR (which was all I really needed back then). You can hardly go in to Walmart and buy even an OTA ATSC DVR (I think there might be one chinese company that is making some low-pro effort to provide this but I haven't really investigated). Tivo is still there but as always its expensive and I'm not even sure that it is compatible with OTA anymore (someone can correct me if that is wrong).

So you've got your cablecos and satcos that provide their DVR box for RENT (no thanks). And both (as well as Tivo) are just now getting into the whole house distribution space that WMC & Sage have been doing for years. Then there are still all of those intangibles that cableco & satco boxes can't do that make PCs the perfect fit...infinitely large storage capability, personal file storage, management and instant access capability. I guess Tivo is now able to access PC content from over the LAN so they're pretty close to a PC replacement but they're still expensive and you still have to have the PC available to do the file storage and management. So if you've got to have the PC anyway, why not let it be the DVR and the 10ft interface instead of the Tivo? No way the cableco is going to do anything to help you consolidate your own personal collection with their content selection...that's like holy sacrilage to them. I think Directv and Dish also may be like the Tivo now where they will share and coexist with your PC on the network but again, you have to have a PC for that to work so two systems instead of just one. To be fair, if you choose a sat based system, since they are proprietary you can't use a PC anyway but how greedy/stingy/stupid is it that they want to be closed off from everyone else?

Then there is streaming content that everyone wants and providers want to offer. Cablecos, Tivo, satcos all have it integrated into there boxes. PCs (from which the very term originated) do not have it so nicely integrated. But it is still possible to achieve on a PC. You mostly just have to get out of the 10ft UI to make it useable and go back to a good ol' keyboard & mouse instead of your nice fancy IR/RF remote to get it done.

Cable's big selling point used to be On-Demand. But now that Android and iApple devices have the cableco apps on them you can watch the On-Demand content through that instead of the cablecard. I have both the Time Warner web browser Relaunch linked inside of WMC7 and I have an Android tablet that stays connected through HDMI to my TV to deal with their On-Demand content. I know I could get a Chromecast and do it that way but a $6 HDMI cable to tablet does the same thing without another purchase.

I'm hoping for the day when we retire cablecards and OTA tuners in general and we receive all content via TCP/IP. Win8 would be perfect for that method of delivery if it was only remote control friendly. Could you image any PC (Win8, Mac or Android based) connected to a big screen TV with nothing but app icons all across the screen...controllable by IR/RF remote, keyboard, touchscreen, kinect style gesturing or even remote with phone or tablet? TV would just be an app/icon provided through webstream and the channels you receive are dependent on your subscription. You'd still retain your PC/hard drive based DVR capability as well as add the convenience of cloud storage if you desired (more wishful thinking). No subscription? No problem, all you get are the current OTA channels that have been converted to TCPIP. Hopefully by then 6Mb broadband will be free (hahahaha - not likely but one can hope...just like one can hope all of these corporations would realize that they'd make much more money if they'd give us what we want rather than what they think we need).

So once more with emphasis...how does WMC stack up against other DVRs today? Show me which standalone DVRs can do all of the things that WMC7 can (functionality wise). How do they stack up price wise? What extra efforts do you have to go through to make them behave the same? In most cases, to have the same functionality you're going to have to involve a network connected PC. Since you're going to have to involve a PC anyway to get that functionality, why not just use a PC as your entertainment hub? Or your other choice (for simplicity sake) is to eliminate that other functionality and just use the DVR and limited streaming capability of the proprietary closed box.

How does WMC stack up against other PC based 10ft UI and DVR software? Well for sure it is not as pretty, fairly dated and doesn't have the eye candy. You can fix that by using XBMC or Media Browser in conjunction with WMC. And dependent upon your cable subscription package it is the ONLY native way to get copy protected content into a PC. Note I said native. HD-PVR and Nextcom R5000-HD are not native. They do work too but for the hoops you go through to get it working (and the price) you may as well get Tivo or Direct/Dish boxes and connect them to your network.

When will this all end? I do hope soon. But I'm so afraid that the hardware mfgs and content providers are going to screw it up even worse than what it already is I just don't want to think about going into the future. I'm sure they're not going to implement IP based TV the way I want it done and they're not going to stop until they make sure to lock everything down so that you are not allowed to have your own content at home anymore...(this might include your own personal photos and home movies...imagine cloud storage content of your family that is determined to be ISP intellectual property because they own the storage...I'm sure someone with extremely deep pockets could get a federal judge to agree with him on this principle and there goes the end of your personal rights).

Oh well, to each his own...spend your money on whatever you want...as long as it makes you happy. Just things to think about on a rainy day.

/rant off

[barnabas1969]

I hate to say it, but I switched to Dish last October and it's been fantastic. We had a lot of snow this winter and I only had to clean the dish off one time. It's mounted to a pole on the ground so no big deal. The sling function works great. The limited tuners can be an issue once in a while, but a new Joey (extender) is supposed to be out this year which adds two more tuners. It has some crappy apps but I hope they add more. I would love to see them add Netflix but I don't see it happening.

Wow, that sounds like a glowing endorsement! Crappy apps, not enough tuners, and weather conditions can affect your signal. Sign me up, Scotty!

Try living in a sub-tropical climate where rain falls in buckets, and clouds can extend from (almost) ground level up to many thousands of feet above sea level. Everyone I know who has satellite here in Florida is unhappy with the fact that their service is so frequently interrupted by the weather. In fact, I'll take it further (who knew?)... besides folks who live so far out in the sticks that they can't get cable TV, the ONLY people I know who switched to satellite did so for financial reasons... and almost all of them switched back after their contract was up!

Oh... and I forgot to mention... the cable provider in my area (Brighthouse) has no contracts. They also have a money-back guarantee... if you don't like their service after 30 days, it won't cost you a dime. They will refund the entire cost, including all up-front costs (which includes running new cables to the rooms in your house).

And... even after the first 30 days, if a service tech shows up late to their 2-hour appointment window, the service call is free. They charge less to run a coax to any room in your house than it would often cost for the coax itself. Each drop is $25, no matter what. It's not even worth crawling through the attic for 25 bucks!

U-Verse is available in my area, but they have a limit on how many shows an entire household can watch/record! The limit depends... in most places it's 2 HD shows, plus 2 SD shows. In other places it's 4 HD shows, plus 2 SD shows. That's a household limit. And, when you're using all of your video services, it affects your Internet speed. I don't watch SD anything anymore... so I couldn't live with that limit.

There are very few apps for Media Center, and the ones available are more hacks than anything. That's probably a wash. On Demand content goes to dish. Tuners go to Media Center. Sling function goes to Dish. You can also send shows right to your phone or tablet to watch offline. Reliability goes to Dish. Plus it's great for the WAF. If something should break, it's Dish's fault not mine.

I have Brighthouse at my vacation home in Davenport and I'm not impressed. I agree about running the coax. I have no urge to climb into a Flordia attic with all the creepy crawlies to save $25.

Ummm... Media Center has wayyy more apps than my cable company has, and they're better than the cable co's apps too. A wash? I don't think so. On Demand doesn't matter. Do you enjoy paying your cable/sat provider $4.99 to watch a show "on-demand" that will cost you ONE DOLLAR to rent at the Red Box at your local Wal-Mart or Walgreens?

Sling? Not sure about that. People who don't have to deal with copy-protection can do whatever they want with their content (ATSC, FIOS, etc). Others can use an extender plus an HD-PVR (using the analog hole) to remove the copy protection. For me... I don't give a rat's butt about watching my shows outside the house. On the rare occasion when I'm sitting in an airport or whatever, I can always watch a show on Netflix, Amazon, Youtube, or (fill_in_the_blank) if I wanted to.

Reliability goes to Dish? Did you not read my post? I live in a place where it is not unusual for rain to come down in literal sheets of water. The expression "raining cats and dogs" was born in Florida. It's pretty common here for 2-3 inches of rain to fall in 30 minutes. I've seen my pool go from the middle of the tile to overflowing in less than an hour on many occasions. I actually have a special 1" pipe from the pool which is cut to an exact height just below the top of my skimmer... just so the water will eventually drain down below the top of the skimmer. It happens all the time here. Anytime there is heavy cloud cover or heavy rain (you have to live here to understand the word "heavy"), satellite TV just plain stops working! Reliable? No.

I can't say much about Davenport, except that it's a hick town. I'm familiar with the area. My mother was born in nearby Haines City (in 1929) and I have family there. But, I can say that Brighthouse is more reliable than my local electric utility (FPL), and that the signal quality in my 50+ year old neighborhood is top notch. Granted, I had to scream bloody murder in order to get a whole crew of BHN linemen out here to replace a bunch of the local infrastructure... but they did it! Ever since, my signal has been perfect. My PQ on cable is equal to OTA... and I have both.

Oh... BTW... I've screamed bloody murder with FPL too. Their reliability has gone from momentary power outages which last 1-2 seconds one or two times a day, to 1-2 second outages once every week or two. It's a big improvement, but still not what I consider acceptable for an electric utility that claims the highest reliability in the USA. Recently, FPL was replacing some poles in my neighborhood as part of their program to (finally) replace the rotten poles (only after public outcry when so many of their poles fell down during the 2004-2005 hurricanes). They were replacing a pole two houses down from mine, and they didn't consider the fact that when they released the tension from the lines... that the cables might touch! (duh) I had a fireworks show in my backyard. Thankfully, I have a whole-home surge protector, and UPS's on all the sensitive electronics in my house. I happened to be home at the time, and when I saw the flashes of light... I immediately turned off the electric service to my house. Competence? When a guy showed up at my door to ask permission to enter my backyard, he said... "I'm surprised the lines didn't burn all the way through." He expected that the crew would have to string new cables! Yeah... competence.

[lithium630]

Ummm... Media Center has wayyy more apps than my cable company has, and they're better than the cable co's apps too. A wash? I don't think so. On Demand doesn't matter. Do you enjoy paying your cable/sat provider $4.99 to watch a show "on-demand" that will cost you ONE DOLLAR to rent at the Red Box at your local Wal-Mart or Walgreens?

Sling? Not sure about that. People who don't have to deal with copy-protection can do whatever they want with their content (ATSC, FIOS, etc). Others can use an extender plus an HD-PVR (using the analog hole) to remove the copy protection. For me... I don't give a rat's butt about watching my shows outside the house. On the rare occasion when I'm sitting in an airport or whatever, I can always watch a show on Netflix, Amazon, Youtube, or (fill_in_the_blank) if I wanted to.

Reliability goes to Dish? Did you not read my post? I live in a place where it is not unusual for rain to come down in literal sheets of water. The expression "raining cats and dogs" was born in Florida. It's pretty common here for 2-3 inches of rain to fall in 30 minutes. I've seen my pool go from the middle of the tile to overflowing in less than an hour on many occasions. I actually have a special 1" pipe from the pool which is cut to an exact height just below the top of my skimmer... just so the water will eventually drain down below the top of the skimmer. It happens all the time here. Anytime there is heavy cloud cover or heavy rain (you have to live here to understand the word "heavy"), satellite TV just plain stops working! Reliable? No.

I can't say much about Davenport, except that it's a hick town. I'm familiar with the area. My mother was born in nearby Haines City (in 1929) and I have family there. But, I can say that Brighthouse is more reliable than my local electric utility (FPL), and that the signal quality in my 50+ year old neighborhood is top notch. Granted, I had to scream bloody murder in order to get a whole crew of BHN linemen out here to replace a bunch of the local infrastructure... but they did it! Ever since, my signal has been perfect. My PQ on cable is equal to OTA... and I have both.

Oh... BTW... I've screamed bloody murder with FPL too. Their reliability has gone from momentary power outages which last 1-2 seconds one or two times a day, to 1-2 second outages once every week or two. It's a big improvement, but still not what I consider acceptable for an electric utility that claims the highest reliability in the USA. Recently, FPL was replacing some poles in my neighborhood as part of their program to (finally) replace the rotten poles (only after public outcry when so many of their poles fell down during the 2004-2005 hurricanes). They were replacing a pole two houses down from mine, and they didn't consider the fact that when they released the tension from the lines... that the cables might touch! (duh) I had a fireworks show in my backyard. Thankfully, I have a whole-home surge protector, and UPS's on all the sensitive electronics in my house. I happened to be home at the time, and when I saw the flashes of light... I immediately turned off the electric service to my house. Competence? When a guy showed up at my door to ask permission to enter my backyard, he said... "I'm surprised the lines didn't burn all the way through." He expected that the crew would have to string new cables! Yeah... competence.

I explained why Dish is better for me. I did not say it is better for you. I use the sling feature all the time. My wife hates The Walking Dead so I watch it while on the treadmill. Work arounds in media center are better than nothing, but not nearly as good. I use On Demand for the free content occasionally. Mostly if I forget to set a recording. It has a lot of small features also. You can sort recordings into folders. You can make your own guide list. (Yes I know Media Center can also, but Comcast and Brighthouse can't). I have a second Hopper for the kids, and the Joey's can access both.

[mike_ekim]

I explained why Dish is better for me. I did not say it is better for you.

^^ This.

The particular features of MCE do not align with everyone's needs. For my household, a cable company's DVR is exactly perfect EXCEPT it costs so much. I pay $38/month for cable. The cable company does not offer a DVR with my package. I need a $70 package, $9/month for the DVR, and $9/month for DVR service. That's an extra $50/month for a DVR! Daddy wants to save that $600 a year, and it justifies his computer hobby. Edit: I forgot about all the free OnDemand content, it is an easy way to catch up on shows (vs. juggling Hulu/Netflix/Network websites).

I bought a PC with a Haswell i3 (35 watts!), Windows 7 preinstalled, for $300 (Refurb because the power button wasn't correctly installed on that line of computers) so considering the hardware cost I basically got Windows 7 for free. I added Plex and MCEBuddy. As far as I can tell my cable provider (Cox) doesn't flag any of my programs copy-once, so I don't even need MCE but it's installed so I might as well use it, and if my provider ever starts flagging programs I won't have to update anything.

I can covert with MCEBuddy and watch on the Roku, using the free/donate Plex channel. More importantly, my kids can watch all their shows on the Roku. It's drop dead simple. The only downside is that I have to schedule recordings.

There are ways to get live TV from the HDHomerun Prime but they seemed half-baked. If SD ever releases a cable card tuner with transcoding I'll get one and my Roku/PC will jointly become a cable box.