Spanning Tree Protocol (STP)

[shortcut3d]

I recently upgraded the network to all Ubiquiti hardware: EdgeMax EdgeRouter Lite, UniFi AP-AC and ToughSwitch(s). The entire system is patched together with 24AWG bare copper FTP Cat6a cables and punched down with Cat6 panel. In addition, I upgraded my NAS to a Synology DS1813+ which has 4 Gigabit Ethernet ports. The EdgeRouter has a hardware accelerated bridge between the WLAN and LAN so AFP and UPnP can be routed between WLAN and LAN. Due to the bridge and multi-port NAS, I've elected to enable STP. All devices are managed with Static Maps (easier than maintaining a separate spreadsheet in a home environment). The network is very responsive as expected,except the Echo(s). STP seems to make the Echo(s) 'Waiting for the Network' to get an IP address.

I may switch off STP, but need to test the impact from WLAN to LAN, and on the NAS.

[STC]

Sounds sexy.
Are you running spanning tree on levels 2 and 3?
How do you have your network segmented? Do you have a topology schematic?

[Crash2009]

It does sound sexy. Enabling STP on my switch knocked 30 seconds off the Echo boot time.

[barnabas1969]

I don't know about you guys, but the way I read the OP, it seems that he is saying that STP made the Echo's boot time worse.

[Crash2009]

I think something else is not quite right. My Echo's like STP.

[shortcut3d]

My Echo does not like STP enabled. I also thought it would improve boot times, but its the exact opposite. The new network has considerably improved Echo boot times without STP. Fortunately the network does not have any loops or redundancy links.

The Network was originally segmented between WLAN and LAN, but AFP and UPnP can not be routed with the EdgeRouter Lite. It's currently bridged.

Cable Mode -> ERL eth0
ERL eth1 -> UAP-AC
ERL eth2 -> TS1 -> Echo1, DS eth0, DS eth1, Uplink to TS2
TS2 -> HTPC, Echo2, InfiniTV6 ETH

ERL eth1 & 2 are bridged
DHCP service on ERL 10.0.1.0/24 2-200

If I build redundancy (other than the already implemented MCS on iSCSI), I will simply use port trunking. Due to limited space in my wiring panel, that will not happen until the EdgeRouter POE is generally available.

[STC]

I was focussing on the 'sexy' setup as a whole.

[STC]

It does sound sexy. Enabling STP on my switch knocked 30 seconds off the Echo boot time.

crash, STP is a routing protocol and really only comes into its' own when used on bridged lans in layer 2.
If your network is a managed switch and a router, I'm not sure (although nothing would surprise me) that your Echo's are responding to the fact STP is on, but rather your switch functioning in a more organized manner.

[shortcut3d]

It does sound sexy. Enabling STP on my switch knocked 30 seconds off the Echo boot time.

crash, STP is a routing protocol and really only comes into its' own when used in bridged lans on layer 2.
If your network is a managed switch and a router, I'm not sure (although nothing would surprise me) that your Echo's are responding to the fact STP is on, but rather your switch functioning in a more organized manner.

Updated my previous post with topology.

Also STP was enabled at Layer 2 & 3 at the root and Layer 2 at the switches.

Further testing seems to show the IP address assignment is lagging on the Echo, but after assignment the Echo performs better. Without STP the Echo is more like the old network. With STP (other than DHCP) the Echo seems more responsive.

[Crash2009]

Further testing seems to show the IP address assignment is lagging on the Echo, but after assignment the Echo performs better.

Thats exactly what mine was doing back in January (I think), 75 seconds (30 second lag) to boot into MCE when the Echo was plugged into the switch (managed yes). What got me going on this was it was only 45 seconds to boot into MCE when Echo was plugged into the router. Some guy over at AVS and Erkotz told me to enable STP in the switch. Venom helped with the switch config.

As a test, have you tried patching the Echo directly into the router?

[Crash2009]

I was mistaken STC. I just looked up my old STP post from January. I enabled Fast Link in the STP Port Settings. Fast Link is also known as portfast. Different switches have different names for it. Turn it on Shortcut, and your Echo will boot faster.

http://www.thegreenbutton.tv/forums/vie ... 333#p40333

[barnabas1969]

Back when I had an Echo, I tried both managed and unmanaged switches... with STP on and off. Nothing seemed to make a difference. The Echo took what seemed like forever to get an IP address... but every other device on my network (including PC's, HP extenders, Linksys extenders, and other devices) got an IP address almost instantly.

[shortcut3d]

I was mistaken STC. I just looked up my old STP post from January. I enabled Fast Link in the STP Port Settings. Fast Link is also known as portfast. Different switches have different names for it. Turn it on Shortcut, and your Echo will boot faster.

http://www.thegreenbutton.tv/forums/vie ... 333#p40333

I'm curious what setting is Fast Link or Port Fast. There are about 4 parameters and two types of STP available. RSTP allows for faster analysis of the network for quicker forwarding and blocking. Then there is Max Age, Hello Time, Forward Delay, Priority.

I had to turn off MCS on iSCSI without STP enabled. There were weird pauses in playback when using MCS and STP disabled.

[Sammy2]

Further testing seems to show the IP address assignment is lagging on the Echo, but after assignment the Echo performs better.

Thats exactly what mine was doing back in January (I think), 75 seconds (30 second lag) to boot into MCE when the Echo was plugged into the switch (managed yes). What got me going on this was it was only 45 seconds to boot into MCE when Echo was plugged into the router. Some guy over at AVS and Erkotz told me to enable STP in the switch. Venom helped with the switch config.

As a test, have you tried patching the Echo directly into the router?

Seems to be the problem. This needs to be fixed. Not having a managed switches probably does not help for me. Is there a way to do this in the router itself?

[Crash2009]

I'm curious what setting is Fast Link or Port Fast. There are about 4 parameters and two types of STP available. RSTP allows for faster analysis of the network for quicker forwarding and blocking. Then there is Max Age, Hello Time, Forward Delay, Priority.

My guess would be none of the above. Look for an STP setting that has "fast" in it.

3com = Fast Start

Foundry = Fast Port

Dell = Spanning Tree Fast Link

Cisco = PortFast or STP Fast Link

[erkotz]

As others have mentioned, enabling spanning tree itself should not increase Echo's boot speed. However, if you are running spanning tree, enabling portfast/fast link/whatever your switch calls it should improve the boot speed.

With spanning tree on (no portfast) the switch blocks traffic on the port for 60 seconds until it determines there is no loop
With spanning tree and portfast on, the switch brings the port up first, then listens in the background for looped BPDUs (and will down the port if necessary)

While traffic is blocked on the port, the Echo (or any device) can't get an IP address, so it stalls the boot process.

[shortcut3d]

As others have mentioned, enabling spanning tree itself should not increase Echo's boot speed. However, if you are running spanning tree, enabling portfast/fast link/whatever your switch calls it should improve the boot speed.

With spanning tree on (no portfast) the switch blocks traffic on the port for 60 seconds until it determines there is no loop
With spanning tree and portfast on, the switch brings the port up first, then listens in the background for looped BPDUs (and will down the port if necessary)

While traffic is blocked on the port, the Echo (or any device) can't get an IP address, so it stalls the boot process.

I believe that the RSTP parameters of Hello Time and Forward Delay are the parameters that are impacting the Echo start up time. This switch does not have a fast option.

[erkotz]

As others have mentioned, enabling spanning tree itself should not increase Echo's boot speed. However, if you are running spanning tree, enabling portfast/fast link/whatever your switch calls it should improve the boot speed.

With spanning tree on (no portfast) the switch blocks traffic on the port for 60 seconds until it determines there is no loop
With spanning tree and portfast on, the switch brings the port up first, then listens in the background for looped BPDUs (and will down the port if necessary)

While traffic is blocked on the port, the Echo (or any device) can't get an IP address, so it stalls the boot process.

I believe that the RSTP parameters of Hello Time and Forward Delay are the parameters that are impacting the Echo start up time. This switch does not have a fast option.

I believe modifying the forward delay to something minimal (possibly 0) is what you would want to do. Obviously if your network has a loop, it would loop momentarily till the BPDUs come back to the switch, but the same happens with portfast.

[IownFIVEechos]

Thank you Shortcut.

I was successful in getting my echo's to boot much faster now. I have a cisco 2960 in place and turned on the above suggestions. The thing that I can not understand is I also have a cheap d-link 4 port coming off the cisco and that echo that is connected to the d-link booted fast always. That was the only reason I ever found out these things can actually boot in a reasonable amount of time. But why would the one connected to the d-link which is then connected to the cisco which did not have the STP turned on, booted up fast ( you see the IP immediately opposed to waiting!) I can remove my coffee joke from a different topic now!. But thanks for bringing this to light.

[shortcut3d]

Thank you Shortcut.

I was successful in getting my echo's to boot much faster now. I have a cisco 2960 in place and turned on the above suggestions. The thing that I can not understand is I also have a cheap d-link 4 port coming off the cisco and that echo that is connected to the d-link booted fast always. That was the only reason I ever found out these things can actually boot in a reasonable amount of time. But why would the one connected to the d-link which is then connected to the cisco which did not have the STP turned on, booted up fast ( you see the IP immediately opposed to waiting!) I can remove my coffee joke from a different topic now!. But thanks for bringing this to light.

I'll try enabling STP again with Port Forwarding set to a minimal number. I may be able to set it by individual port, but I'm not sure. I know there are some individual port settings for STP like edge port.

The reason why the unmanaged D-link switch with the Echo gets an IP immediately is because the port on your managed switch with STP has already mapped the network at Layer 2 and knows there is an active port(s) without a loop, so the port forward is not delayed.

My question is why does the echo behave like this? All other network devices get IPs from the DHCP immediately.