Apple Discussion

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Sammy2

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Apple Discussion

#1

Post by Sammy2 » Tue May 07, 2013 11:29 am

kingwr wrote:Precisely. And especially not another dual-boot device that has an extender function and an android function that takes an expert to switch back and forth. I have an X-Box that my wife and kids already can't use. Everybody can use the DMA2100s for TV, and stick a game in the XBox, but nobody wants to navigate multiple levels of menus to switch back and forth between modes. I just wish Apple would finally conquer the whole TV thing, and then our ecosystem here would be complete.
apple?

[Moderator note: Topic split from the State of the Echo #3 thread]

slowbiscuit

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#2

Post by slowbiscuit » Tue May 07, 2013 2:27 pm

LOL @apple, no way am I going to be locked into whatever they think is best.

kingwr

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#3

Post by kingwr » Tue May 07, 2013 3:33 pm

That is a ridiculous statement. Would you preferred to be locked into whatever Microsoft thinks is best or what Ceton thinks is best? Microsoft evidently thinks that the best thing is for Media Center to slowly die away. Is that what you want to be locked into? While I have been attached to Media Center from the beginning and can be accused of being a Media Center fanboy, I go with the best-of-breed products in actual usage, and that is why I have DirecTV/AppleTV combination in my primary viewing areas. This combination provides the best ease-of-use, the most HD/1080P content, and the widest variety of capabilities, IMO. The only think left out of this equation is Amazon Prime Streaming, which I hope will be rectified shortly.

Sammy2

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#4

Post by Sammy2 » Tue May 07, 2013 3:36 pm

kingwr wrote:That is a ridiculous statement. Would you preferred to be locked into whatever Microsoft thinks is best or what Ceton thinks is best? Microsoft evidently thinks that the best thing is for Media Center to slowly die away. Is that what you want to be locked into? While I have been attached to Media Center from the beginning and can be accused of being a Media Center fanboy, I go with the best-of-breed products in actual usage, and that is why I have DirecTV/AppleTV combination in my primary viewing areas. This combination provides the best ease-of-use, the most HD/1080P content, and the widest variety of capabilities, IMO. The only think left out of this equation is Amazon Prime Streaming, which I hope will be rectified shortly.
Why are you posting in here then? This is the Green Button, a forum dedicated to WMC. It is not going to die anytime soon because WMC under Win7 is supported until 2015 and under Win8 until probably 2018 at the earliest.

Does the appleTV allow you to tune your directTV content on another TV?

jeonunh

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#5

Post by jeonunh » Tue May 07, 2013 5:06 pm

Sammy2 wrote:
kingwr wrote:That is a ridiculous statement. Would you preferred to be locked into whatever Microsoft thinks is best or what Ceton thinks is best? Microsoft evidently thinks that the best thing is for Media Center to slowly die away. Is that what you want to be locked into? While I have been attached to Media Center from the beginning and can be accused of being a Media Center fanboy, I go with the best-of-breed products in actual usage, and that is why I have DirecTV/AppleTV combination in my primary viewing areas. This combination provides the best ease-of-use, the most HD/1080P content, and the widest variety of capabilities, IMO. The only think left out of this equation is Amazon Prime Streaming, which I hope will be rectified shortly.
Why are you posting in here then? This is the Green Button, a forum dedicated to WMC. It is not going to die anytime soon because WMC under Win7 is supported until 2015 and under Win8 until probably 2018 at the earliest.

Does the appleTV allow you to tune your directTV content on another TV?
Mine doesn't, but then again my Echo doesn't let me view Netflix or any of the other things my ATV does. I would personally love to see Apple attack the TV market. I would probably resist using it, but it would light a fire under Microsoft's ass to bring WMC back into active development. Then again, I thought the iPhone was a gimmick when it came out (now own one) and then I thought the iPad was silly when it came out (now own one) and really saw no point in the AppleTv (now own one). I also bought a MacBook Pro, although I use Windows 7 on it in BootCamp more than I ever boot into OSX. Apple just makes good products that work.

Imagine for a minute that Apple does enter the TV/DVR market. You can bet that the already released ATV's would receive an update that allowed them to work as extenders.

Sammy2

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#6

Post by Sammy2 » Tue May 07, 2013 5:19 pm

jeonunh wrote:
Sammy2 wrote:
kingwr wrote:That is a ridiculous statement. Would you preferred to be locked into whatever Microsoft thinks is best or what Ceton thinks is best? Microsoft evidently thinks that the best thing is for Media Center to slowly die away. Is that what you want to be locked into? While I have been attached to Media Center from the beginning and can be accused of being a Media Center fanboy, I go with the best-of-breed products in actual usage, and that is why I have DirecTV/AppleTV combination in my primary viewing areas. This combination provides the best ease-of-use, the most HD/1080P content, and the widest variety of capabilities, IMO. The only think left out of this equation is Amazon Prime Streaming, which I hope will be rectified shortly.
Why are you posting in here then? This is the Green Button, a forum dedicated to WMC. It is not going to die anytime soon because WMC under Win7 is supported until 2015 and under Win8 until probably 2018 at the earliest.

Does the appleTV allow you to tune your directTV content on another TV?
Mine doesn't, but then again my Echo doesn't let me view Netflix or any of the other things my ATV does. I would personally love to see Apple attack the TV market. I would probably resist using it, but it would light a fire under Microsoft's butt to bring WMC back into active development. Then again, I thought the iPhone was a gimmick when it came out (now own one) and then I thought the iPad was silly when it came out (now own one) and really saw no point in the AppleTv (now own one). I also bought a MacBook Pro, although I use Windows 7 on it in BootCamp more than I ever boot into OSX. Apple just makes good products that work.

Imagine for a minute that Apple does enter the TV/DVR market. You can bet that the already released ATV's would receive an update that allowed them to work as extenders.
You do realize that the macbook is simply an intel PC right?

kingwr

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#7

Post by kingwr » Tue May 07, 2013 5:45 pm

It has Intel hardware, but it took Apple making MacBooks and MacBook Airs (which I own) to push the PC world into Ultrabook territory, just like the iPod (which I own) dominated the MP3 player market, iPhone (which I own) pushed the cellphone world into touchscreen and app territory, and iPads (which I own) created the tablet marketplace. You have to be a serious hater not to see how Apple innovation in the last 7 to 8 years has dramatically changed the landscape in PCs, tablets, music players, and cellphones. I wish they would do the same for TV.

That said, I still have a Media Center system in my house -- that's why I stay on this forum. I also think I mentioned I was a Media Center fanboy; I'm just not delusional, as others appear to be.

kingwr

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#8

Post by kingwr » Tue May 07, 2013 5:58 pm

Sammy2 wrote:Does the appleTV allow you to tune your directTV content on another TV?
No, but DirecTV does, and much better than current Media Center extenders do. The problem with DirecTV is that it has no Netflix or other movie sources (in favor of its own on-demand) and that it is rather poor at locating and playing locally sourced content (movies, music, pictures, videos, etc. from your LAN). With all of that media in an iTunes library, however, the AppleTV does a superb job of accessing it, as well as purchased media from the cloud, shared photo albums, Netflix, Yahoo, Hulu, etc. Also, the AirStream feature is probably the most used feature of our AppleTV, because we can just say "hey look at this" and put whatever content we are looking at up on the big screen to share with everybody in the room.

If I could access the DirecTV DVR from an app in my AppleTV, it would be perfect for us. But just like every other platform and solution, there are hurdles holding back the perfect solution, so I stick with the best combination possible. To suggest that Apple user's are somehow more "locked in" to Apples products than Media Center users are locked into Microsoft products is ridiculous, however, thus my previous statement.

vert18

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#9

Post by vert18 » Tue May 07, 2013 6:04 pm

can watch DNLA live tv on my Apple TV now.. of course it's booting Crystalbutu 1.0 with XBMC Eden and yea it has a crystal hd card

and yes it plays HBO just fine.. or the similar

dunno how to record DNLA tv yet..
should look into it
think I need a PVR running a backend that has a front end plug in XBMC.. maybe myth tv or such..
Last edited by vert18 on Tue May 07, 2013 6:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

barnabas1969

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#10

Post by barnabas1969 » Tue May 07, 2013 6:11 pm

The problem with Apple, as I see it, is that you're locked into the iCloud in order to have access to your content... and that access comes with a recurring fee. That's how it is with the wife's iPhone, and she hates that she has to pay to store stuff in the iCloud. She'd much rather be able to use a SD memory stick. Is the Apple TV locked down as far as local storage goes? Do you have to "rent" space from the iCloud?

barnabas1969

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#11

Post by barnabas1969 » Tue May 07, 2013 6:12 pm

vert18 wrote:can watch DNLA live tv on my Apple TV now.. of course it's booting Crystalbutu 1.0 with XBMC Eden and yea it has a crystal hd card
OK, but since it's no longer running the stock firmware, then it isn't truly an Apple TV, is it? It's kinda like running Windows on a Mac (but almost never running OSX) and raving about how great Apple is.

Sammy2

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#12

Post by Sammy2 » Tue May 07, 2013 6:17 pm

You do realize that apple did not invent the touch screen. They also do not produce what they sell. Their screens are mainly manufactured by Samsung and their electronics by Foxconn. They have a fabulous marketing department and are wonderful at putting ideas to fruition though. They even acquired the mouse from Xerox and made a better GUI after Xerox couldn't figure it out. But they aren't the only game in town. One day someone else will come along to displace them.

vert18

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#13

Post by vert18 » Tue May 07, 2013 6:29 pm

I think a tree fell in some remote forest with no one around..
...

ya it's hacked to run Linux
it's an Apple TV one(silver)

tho my appleTV 2(black) also is running XBMC through a jailbreak by Firecore it runs iOS and XBMC is just an app inside... it does not run DNLA tv.. because its on FRODO version and the teamXBMC broke DNLA function in FRODO.. they will fix it eventually

my appleTV 3 does not run anything but iOS

I hate android.. but love Linux, go figure? and been running Linux for over 17 years.. like openBSD too

...
so we waiting for team Ceton echo to rewrite echo for android.. while totally ignoring what it was sold as

jeonunh

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#14

Post by jeonunh » Tue May 07, 2013 6:41 pm

barnabas1969 wrote:
vert18 wrote:can watch DNLA live tv on my Apple TV now.. of course it's booting Crystalbutu 1.0 with XBMC Eden and yea it has a crystal hd card
OK, but since it's no longer running the stock firmware, then it isn't truly an Apple TV, is it? It's kinda like running Windows on a Mac (but almost never running OSX) and raving about how great Apple is.
Thanks for the dig.... The reason I run Windows more than OSX has more to do with the household technology ecosystem. I have multiple computers and servers all running versions of Windows, and handling remote desktop sessions, stuff for work, and other tasks are just easier when using Windows. I bought a MacBook Pro because it is work of art from a hardware standpoint. Obviously I could have bought something less expensive, but I just like the MBP. It also allows me to play with OSX to decide if maybe I would be interested in converting someday.

Honestly though, Apple is pretty great. I used to be anti-Apple and scoffed at everyone that talked about how great Macs were for video editing and graphic design. The fact is, they made some pretty game changing new products in the last few years that have changed the way people do things. iPods, iPhones, iPads, etc. The ATV is still more of a hobby for Apple, but if they get behind it.... look out.

foxwood

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#15

Post by foxwood » Tue May 07, 2013 7:45 pm

kingwr wrote:It has Intel hardware, but it took Apple making MacBooks and MacBook Airs (which I own) to push the PC world into Ultrabook territory, just like the iPod (which I own) dominated the MP3 player market, iPhone (which I own) pushed the cellphone world into touchscreen and app territory, and iPads (which I own) created the tablet marketplace. You have to be a serious hater not to see how Apple innovation in the last 7 to 8 years has dramatically changed the landscape in PCs, tablets, music players, and cellphones. I wish they would do the same for TV.
I think you've bought into a version of history that Apple wants you to believe.

The iPod wasn't a runaway success when it was first released. It took 18 months to sell a million units. Of course, it was Mac only for most of that time, and a million unit's in the Mac world was a huge success, so when iTunes for Windows was finally released, people were prepared to spend $400 on this "massively successful" MP3 player that was in fact wasn't "massively successful" compared to equipment in the Windows market.

iTunes was what really made the difference - you couldn't (easily) play your iTunes purchases on those other MP3 players, and iTunes did a better job than most of it's competitors at the time.

The iPhone also wasn't quite the revolution that people seem to remember - it was still being outsold by BlackBerry a year after launch, and it wasn't the first phone with a touch-screen, or the first phone with an app-store (in fact, the app-store didn't turn up until almost 18 months after the iPhone was introduced). But it did come with that price premium that people automatically attached to iGear, which allowed Apple to spend $650 million between 2007 and 2011 in iPhone advertising (as against $150 million to actually develop the iPhone). In the US market, it also introduced customers to the idea that you could pay for a phone seperately from the phone service.

By the time the iPad came out, Apple recognized that playing the premium game might be dangerous. Instead of the $1000 price tag that many thought the market would bear, the iPad came out at $600. This was because the hardware was coming along in leaps and bounds, and Apple recognized that giving it's competitors a $1000 budget for hardware would make the market too attractive. By lowering the ceiling, the early competitors to the iPad ended up making compromises that gave the iPad a clear field for longer than would otherwise have been the case.

And yet the iPad itself isn't a game-changer, per se. It's not fair to say that it's just a big smart phone, but technically, it doesn't really do much more than a smart phone. Most of the 40 million iPads sold in 2011 were sold in addition to, not instead of, PCs and laptops.

The big takeaway from all this is that ordinary users were prepared to pay $100-$200 extra for the Apple brand, and it was able to leverage success in one area to build success in another. If Microsoft had been able to generate even $50 in profit for every successful WMC deployment, I think we'd have seen a very, very different approach, but that's not the eco-system that developed. Microsoft wouldn't have been allowed to develop an App-store model (everyone else would have screamed anti-trust) and the only obvious route to revenue for WMC was in partnership with the media providers, and that's never going to be happy place - just ask any average Cable-Co ATM (aka customer)

barnabas1969

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#16

Post by barnabas1969 » Tue May 07, 2013 11:49 pm

Foxwood, I'm not sure I agree with you 100%, but I think I mostly agree. I just wanted to add a comment...

The iPod is NOT an "MP3" player. It won't play MP3's until they've been converted by iTunes into a format that will play on the iPod. That's one of the things I don't like. Why can't I just copy my MP3's from my PC directly onto an iOS device, and play them?

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#17

Post by crawfish » Wed May 08, 2013 12:07 am

barnabas1969 wrote:The iPod is NOT an "MP3" player. It won't play MP3's until they've been converted by iTunes into a format that will play on the iPod. That's one of the things I don't like. Why can't I just copy my MP3's from my PC directly onto an iOS device, and play them?
Uh, you can. While you do have to use iTunes to get the files onto your iPod, those files can be MP3s, and they will be stored as MP3s in both iTunes and on the iPod. However, you can have iTunes transcode them on the fly during syncs to lower bitrate AAC.

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#18

Post by barnabas1969 » Wed May 08, 2013 12:13 am

Are you sure about that? I thought that iTunes automatically transcodes them no matter what.

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#19

Post by crawfish » Wed May 08, 2013 12:19 am

barnabas1969 wrote:Are you sure about that? I thought that iTunes automatically transcodes them no matter what.
Positive, and again nope.

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#20

Post by milli260876 » Wed May 08, 2013 1:50 am

Apple didn't make game changing products....
they made pretty ones that people with limited intelligence could use
Lee

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