Waiting to pull trigger on a Ceton setup

[docluv01]

Hi everyone,

I've been wanting to pull the trigger on a Ceton setup for a while. I just had a few questions:

I currently have a quad core pc, i7 2700k. I use the pc for file processing of home movies, 1080p blurays etc.

- If I were yo use the tuner, and use 3 to 4 extenders to watch HD content, would the pc be bogged down that much?
- I do have a PCI slot available. Would I get better performance out of the usb version or the PCI version of the tuner card?
- I live in Yonkers NY, with Cablevision. Would I get PPV content that I have ordered via WMC?

Thanks again for your help!

[foxwood]

I currently have a quad core pc, i7 2700k. I use the pc for file processing of home movies, 1080p blurays etc.

- If I were yo use the tuner, and use 3 to 4 extenders to watch HD content, would the pc be bogged down that much?

Absolutely no problem from a CPU point of view. I'd recommend 8GB of RAM to be on the safe side if you expect to run 4 extenders at once.

- I do have a PCI slot available. Would I get better performance out of the usb version or the PCI version of the tuner card?

I can't answer that directly - I don't have the USB version, but the card version is PCIe, not PCI. The main concern with using the internal card is that you have sufficient air-flow to keep it cool, which can be a concern in a crowded case.

- I live in Yonkers NY, with Cablevision. Would I get PPV content that I have ordered via WMC?

To be honest, I've never watched any PPV, but you are supposed to be able to call up an order it, you just won't be able to access it "on demand" as you can with the Cable Company's DVR. (I'm surprised that's not answered on Ceton's FAQ for the InfiniTV it seems like it should be).

[Motz]

Basically agree with foxwood on everything. More ram is always better always, and it is so cheap now. I have PCIe card at home personall, USB have improved vastly since launch, it would just depend on your MOBO as the only issue people really have is with the USB drivers from the manufacturer, but I run a USB at work 24/7 and don't have any issues, the performance is the same between the two. There are also some good combo deals going on right now with echos.

As for PPV I will double check, but I am about 99% sure you are just fine, just like foxwood said it is just the "on demand" stuff that you don't get, but that is with any tuner.

[jerryt]

Hi everyone,

I've been wanting to pull the trigger on a Ceton setup for a while. I just had a few questions:

I currently have a quad core pc, i7 2700k. I use the pc for file processing of home movies, 1080p blurays etc.

- If I were yo use the tuner, and use 3 to 4 extenders to watch HD content, would the pc be bogged down that much?
- I do have a PCI slot available. Would I get better performance out of the usb version or the PCI version of the tuner card?
- I live in Yonkers NY, with Cablevision. Would I get PPV content that I have ordered via WMC?

Thanks again for your help!

My 2 cents ...
PC can handle the recording and streaming.
Go with a Silicondust HDHR Prime.
I don't think you can get PPV

[docluv01]

Thanks for the quick response.

I do indeed have 8 gig of RAM. I use this pc for multiple things. SO I won't notice a pc slowdown?

Am I better off using a dedicated pc? I have a spare Zotac mini pc with an Intel Atom 2.14 dual core. Should I use this instead?

[foxwood]

- I live in Yonkers NY, with Cablevision. Would I get PPV content that I have ordered via WMC?

Just to clarify this a bit. A PPV event is carried on a premium channel, just like HBO or a premium sports channel. Once you pay the premium, that channel is unlocked for your account. Unlike HBO, the premium only buys you a couple of hours access instead of a whole month's access, but other than that, it's exactly the same. You can see what's scheduled, even if you're not "subscribed" at that point, and your cable company should allow you to call, or use a website, to subscribe for an event.

One thing to note is that PPV content is often not recordable - it's marked Copy Never, so you may have to watch it on your cable-cos schedule, not your own.

Video On Demand is different, and you won't have access to VOD on your HTPC, unless your cable company has aVOD web portal that gives you access to VOD on any computer. It doesn't integrate with Windows Media Center.

[docluv01]

Basically agree with foxwood on everything. More ram is always better always, and it is so cheap now. I have PCIe card at home personall, USB have improved vastly since launch, it would just depend on your MOBO as the only issue people really have is with the USB drivers from the manufacturer, but I run a USB at work 24/7 and don't have any issues, the performance is the same between the two. There are also some good combo deals going on right now with echos.

As for PPV I will double check, but I am about 99% sure you are just fine, just like foxwood said it is just the "on demand" stuff that you don't get, but that is with any tuner.

Thanks man! i may opt for the USB then, Because I can use on another pc if need be.

AM I better off using my quad core pc, which is used for multipel things? or shoudl I have a dedicated pc (intel atom dual core 2.14)?

Thanks again!

[foxwood]

I use this pc for multiple things. SO I won't notice a pc slowdown?

Recording and streaming TV isn't particularly intensive, so it won't put an excessive load on your system.

But if you're running a process that tries to grab 100% of available CPU across all cores, then your Media Center experience will suffer. It doesn't really matter that much if a movie encode takes an hour an 15 minutes instead of an hour, but it does make a difference if the video you are watching stutters or the remote is slow to respond because some other process is hogging the system.

So your system has plenty of power to go around, but no long-running CPU intensive job is a good neighbor for any foreground task that requires high responsiveness.

intel atom dual core 2.14

That would probably struggle with 3 or 4 extender sessions.

[docluv01]

Thanks, I geuss I will stick with the big pc then.

I don't plan on watching TV on teh pc itself, just the extenders. I have been playing with media center a little....I'm geussing for the extenders to work, you need to have media center running, I'm guessing you can simply just minimize it? Meaning while extenders are running, you won't hear sound coming from pc correct?

I use this pc for multiple things. SO I won't notice a pc slowdown?

Recording and streaming TV isn't particularly intensive, so it won't put an excessive load on your system.

But if you're running a process that tries to grab 100% of available CPU across all cores, then your Media Center experience will suffer. It doesn't really matter that much if a movie encode takes an hour an 15 minutes instead of an hour, but it does make a difference if the video you are watching stutters or the remote is slow to respond because some other process is hogging the system.

So your system has plenty of power to go around, but no long-running CPU intensive job is a good neighbor for any foreground task that requires high responsiveness.

intel atom dual core 2.14

That would probably struggle with 3 or 4 extender sessions.

[foxwood]

Thanks, I geuss I will stick with the big pc then.

I don't plan on watching TV on teh pc itself, just the extenders. I have been playing with media center a little....I'm geussing for the extenders to work, you need to have media center running, I'm guessing you can simply just minimize it? Meaning while extenders are running, you won't hear sound coming from pc correct?

Nope, Extenders log in as concurrent sessions on the PC (which is why you need extra RAM) - they don't run as foreground processes, and don't interact in any way with Media Center running on the desktop, so there is no indication that Extenders are in use - it would be a bit difficult if 3 different Extender users were watching 3 different things at the same time if the PC had to display it all first!.

Significant parts of Media Center runs as a service in the background, so that recordings can happen when they're sceduled, and the Media center GUI doesn't need to be running for that to happen either (though you will get a notification in the system tray when Media Center activities, such as recording a show, or downloading Guide updates are occurring in the background).

[docluv01]

I see....

hmm, for the big pc, it has 2 onboard video ports, an hdmi and a display port. I use a samsung monitor with speakers built in via hdmi. Is it possible to hook up a second tv to the display port, and use WMC on that independently with independent sound? to the point it doesn't really interfere with what I'm doing on the main monitor?

DO you think the Intel Atom pc could handle 2 extenders?

I've been searching, could a pc be setup as an "extender" for live TV?

Sorry for the multiple questions...i'm just fed up with the lousy DVR cable boxes from my cable company. I don't mind spending money on quality hardware, just trying to understand everything before I make a purchase.

Thanks in advance for your help and patiencE!!!!

Thanks, I geuss I will stick with the big pc then.

I don't plan on watching TV on teh pc itself, just the extenders. I have been playing with media center a little....I'm geussing for the extenders to work, you need to have media center running, I'm guessing you can simply just minimize it? Meaning while extenders are running, you won't hear sound coming from pc correct?

Nope, Extenders log in as concurrent sessions on the PC (which is why you need extra RAM) - they don't run as foreground processes, and don't interact in any way with Media Center running on the desktop, so there is no indication that Extenders are in use - it would be a bit difficult if 3 different Extender users were watching 3 different things at the same time if the PC had to display it all first!.

Significant parts of Media Center runs as a service in the background, so that recordings can happen when they're sceduled, and the Media center GUI doesn't need to be running for that to happen either (though you will get a notification in the system tray when Media Center activities, such as recording a show, or downloading Guide updates are occurring in the background).

[erkotz]

WMC does not support using a second monitor separately from the main PC screen. Regarding the Atom, I would discourage you from using an Atom-based PC, as it likely doesn't meet our system requirements (http://cetoncorp.com/product-support/#1510) and even if it does, while it will work, the performance will likely be underwhelming, especially with extenders.

[foxwood]

I've been searching, could a pc be setup as an "extender" for live TV?

You can't "extend" live TV to anything other than an extender. What you can do from a 2nd PC is access a Tuner across the network, though, so that a 2nd TV can use a tuner that's physically installed in a different computer. With the InfiniTV, you decide at first setup which tuners will be dedicated to which PCs. The Silicon Dust HDHomeRun Prime is a cable-card tuner that isn't actually plugged into a PC - it sits on the network, and one or more PCs can use the tuners on request, either for live TV, or to record a program.

[foxwood]

http://cetoncorp.com/product-support/#1510

Unfortunately, the FAQ on the Ceton site can't be linked to - it uses javascript to dynamically redisplay the page, and that anchor doesn't work when you link directly to the page

[barnabas1969]

I didn't read all the posts above, so forgive me if I'm being redundant...

Don't use an Intel Atom processor. The i7 you mentioned would be overkill, but an i5 quad-core would be fine.

Yes... 8GB of ram for four extenders.

What's already been said about PPV and VOD is correct. You should be able to call and order PPV events (or use your provider's website), but you will not be able to get VOD. I don't miss the VOD stuff at all.

As for PCIe vs USB... there have been many more reports of problems with the USB version, but I don't know if those have all been fixed yet or not. Using USB certainly opens up a whole new set of possible problems with your USB hardware and drivers.

As for SiliconDust HDHR Prime vs InfiniTV... I've gotta agree with "jerryt" on that one. I've owned both, and the SD HD HomeRun Prime has been far better in my opinion. Again, there are those who disagree with me, and this may be something that has been fixed by later drivers, firmware, etc.

[docluv01]

Thanks!

The Atom pc is a pc I have laying around, i'll avoid it

I have a pc I built a few months ago with the i7 2700k cpu.

I got the hefty CPU because I use this pc for multiple things...file sharing, music server, etc. Occasionally, I encode a home movie into a bluray. RAR/UNRAR large files for work. Granted, I do none of the above ALL at the same time. But I do 1 or 2 items at the same time. Bottom line, if I add the tuner and 4 extenders, just want to make sure nothing is going to suffer on performance. Or, should I get more RAM?

I didn't read all the posts above, so forgive me if I'm being redundant...

Don't use an Intel Atom processor. The i7 you mentioned would be overkill, but an i5 quad-core would be fine.

Yes... 8GB of ram for four extenders.

What's already been said about PPV and VOD is correct. You should be able to call and order PPV events (or use your provider's website), but you will not be able to get VOD. I don't miss the VOD stuff at all.

As for PCIe vs USB... there have been many more reports of problems with the USB version, but I don't know if those have all been fixed yet or not. Using USB certainly opens up a whole new set of possible problems with your USB hardware and drivers.

As for SiliconDust HDHR Prime vs InfiniTV... I've gotta agree with "jerryt" on that one. I've owned both, and the SD HD HomeRun Prime has been far better in my opinion. Again, there are those who disagree with me, and this may be something that has been fixed by later drivers, firmware, etc.

[barnabas1969]

My recommendations are for a purpose-built HTPC. How much horsepower you need for a mult-purpose PC depends on what you plan to do all at the same time. For example, recording TV doesn't use much CPU. It doesn't use much Disk I/O either. But if either of them is being utilized nearly 100% by some other process, then your recordings may be messed up during the period that your CPU and/or Disk were maxed out.

I understand the desire to use a PC that you already own (for cost savings), but if you're going to use a multi-purpose PC for your HTPC, then it should be a PC that only gets used casually for things like web browsing and such. If it's going to be a PC that you'll be running heavy-duty processing on (gaming, video encoding, etc), then I would recommend against using that particular PC for your HTPC.

[docluv01]

I will have a dedicated drive for TV Recordings...I think in the meantime, I will start with just 2 extenders. If it gets to be too much, then i'll opt for a pre-built i5 pc to run.

Last question....If I setup the tuner on a pc, then decide to use it on another pc, is there any issue with this? I have read some people havign issues...

Thanks again to EVERYONE for their input!

My recommendations are for a purpose-built HTPC. How much horsepower you need for a mult-purpose PC depends on what you plan to do all at the same time. For example, recording TV doesn't use much CPU. It doesn't use much Disk I/O either. But if either of them is being utilized nearly 100% by some other process, then your recordings may be messed up during the period that your CPU and/or Disk were maxed out.

I understand the desire to use a PC that you already own (for cost savings), but if you're going to use a multi-purpose PC for your HTPC, then it should be a PC that only gets used casually for things like web browsing and such. If it's going to be a PC that you'll be running heavy-duty processing on (gaming, video encoding, etc), then I would recommend against using that particular PC for your HTPC.

[foxwood]

Last question....If I setup the tuner on a pc, then decide to use it on another pc, is there any issue with this? I have read some people havign issues...

Ceton Tuners are dedicated to a particular PC at setup, so it can be a hassle re-assigning them. The SD HDHomeRun Prime tuners aren't permanently assigned, so they can be grabbed on a first come, first served basis when they are needed. The downside of this is that if you have sceduled recordings that need a tuner, but other PCs are using the tuners your recordings won't happen.

[barnabas1969]

Last question....If I setup the tuner on a pc, then decide to use it on another pc, is there any issue with this? I have read some people havign issues...

Ceton Tuners are dedicated to a particular PC at setup, so it can be a hassle re-assigning them.

I'm not sure what you mean here, Foxwood. Nothing prevents you from pulling the Ceton tuner out of one PC and installing it in a different one. The CableCARD is not tied to the PC... it's tied to the tuner. However, if the OP has recorded some copy-protected shows on his i7 PC, he will not be able to transfer those recordings to his new i5 PC.