Launching WMC 8.8.1 and nothing happens

Discussion of getting WMC to work on Windows 10 (unsupported)
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Mugsy

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Re: Launching WMC 8.8.1 and nothing happens

#21

Post by Mugsy » Mon Aug 10, 2020 1:33 pm

An interesting update:

As a test, I restored a backup of Windows 10 Pro (v1903) that works fine on my 12 year old PC to an SSD on this problem (v2004 W10 Pro) computer and all of my playback issues went away. :o

I of course had to allow "Windows Update" to install all the necessary drivers for this new MoBo & CPU, but kept it at v1903.

So either the problem is some key Windows DLLs were changed in v2004, or booting Win10 from the M.2 instead of SSD. (Oddly, the "Don't have permission" to access old folders on drives I *didn't* connect to the 12 year old PC is back, suggesting it has something to do with the new MoBo.) :crazy:

I'm going to get this old v1903 install of W10 running "smoothly" on the new computer, then try installing it to the M.2 to see if it had anything to do with all the trouble I was having (even though I tried changing the record buffer to several different drives.)

I'll report my findings ASAP.

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#22

Post by technodevotee » Mon Aug 10, 2020 2:08 pm

I would be surprised if it is the core files in v2004 or anything to do with the m2 as I have two new PCs with Intel 10920X processor, 16GB RAM, 4GB AMD Radeon RX550 and a 1TB M2 drive.

One is running v1909 and one is running v2004 and everything works perfectly on both of them - just like all my other PCs with various hardware and versions of Windows.

Seems more likely that it is something to do with Graphics Card much like this post viewtopic.php?p=141275#p141275

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#23

Post by Mugsy » Mon Aug 10, 2020 7:22 pm

Very odd.

This older (v1903) install of 64bit Win10 Pro is what has been running on my old 12yo PC for the past few years. I cloned the drive (SSD boot drive) and restored it to an SSD on this new PC. Since the hardware is different, Windows had to download the missing drivers for the different hardware when I first booted, and I had to manually install the driver for my Hauppauge USB TV Tuner, but everything is running smooth as silk (still have the annoying issue of having to Take "Permission" of legacy drives for some odd reason, but eventually I'll have unlocked every restricted folder.)

Exact same hardware that was having so much trouble before, yet now everything works. The ONLY change other than using an older version of 64bit Win10 Pro is that I'm presently booting from an SSD instead of my M.2 (500gb Evo 970.)

How much legacy hardware do you have on your v2004 machine? ALL of my troubles were linked to legacy hardware: An old USB tuner and HDDs I've been using for years going back to before 64bit Win7 Home. It would not surprise me one bit if M$ started killing off support for legacy hardware to force people to "upgrade".

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#24

Post by technodevotee » Mon Aug 10, 2020 10:07 pm

I don't have any legacy hardware in my i9s. All there is is a Quad DVB-T2 PCIe card in one and two Dual DVB-S2 PCIe cards in the other.

However, I've run Windows 10 v2004 on older core2duo and core2quad PCs using PCI DVB-S and DVB-T cards and really old graphics cards with absolutely no problems.

Never had the issue with being denied access to old folders or drives either.

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#25

Post by Mugsy » Tue Aug 11, 2020 1:34 pm

If I had to guess, the drive/folder denial probably has something to do with this new PC using a UEFI bios and the files/folders were created on an old Win7 PC.

But as for why TV playback was unwatchable when I was using a clean install of v2004 to an M.2 (regardless of where the Record Buffer is pointed), but is now smooth running on the same hardware with v1903 is a bizarre mystery.

BTW: I don't think you can rule out "Legacy" hardware support being deliberately broken based on using old DVB tuners since there are modern tuners still using the old DVB chipset. And I'm using an old nVidia GTX670 video card. nVidia (and AMD/ATI) supply their own drivers to MS.

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#26

Post by AFelectrngineer » Fri Aug 14, 2020 11:51 pm

Hello... Brand new here and need an assist. I installed WMC v8.8.4 on Windows 10 Pro build 2004 with all latest updates. Install seemed to go OK with shortcut on desktop. No joy...
- Downloaded technodevotee Fix MSSQLLite, unzipped to WMC v8.8.4 installation file folder (not "bin") and ran the batch file as Administrator - No joy... Shows error in the command prompt
- Downloaded technodevotee ReplaceDLLs, unzipped to WMC v8.8.4 installation file folder (not "bin") and ran the batch file as Administrator - No joy... Shows error in the command prompt

NOTE: Upgraded from Windows 8.1 Pro with WMC to Windows 10 latest build 2004 (Windows upgrade from desktop). I did run the Uninstaller in the WMC installer package BEFORE attempting to load WMC on Windows 10 OS.
Any help GREATLY APPRECIATED. Thanks in advance.

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#27

Post by AFelectrngineer » Sat Aug 15, 2020 2:42 am

UPDATE (partial joy): Uninstalled WMC v8.8.4 and installed technodevotee v13.
- Restarted PC and ran technodevotee "replace_dlls" (found in the WMC v13 install file)
- Restarted PC and ran technodevotee "fixMSSQLLite" (found in the WMC v 13 install file)
- Restarted PC and uninstalled Digital Cable Advisor
- Restarted PC and reinstalled Digital Cable Advisor
Launched WMC - JOY... Hooray! WMC launches and runs. Ran WMC and ran Libraries - Digital Cable Advisor. PC meets digital cable requirements.
Only ONE problem remains. WMC cannot find my TV tuner (Ceton InfiniTV 6 ETH) even though Windows 10 shows it in the Device Manager

QUESTION: What TV cable TUNER are you folks using that works with Windows 10, especially Build 2004? Again... thanks in advance for any assistance.

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#28

Post by Mugsy » Sat Aug 15, 2020 12:52 pm

While LiveTV is working on my PC (now), I've noticed the setup program keeps reporting it has "failed to detect" my tuner every time I've run it.

But I continue on to set it up "manually" as a ATSC device and it has no trouble scanning for channels. Very odd.

I have tried two USB tuners: a cheap kWorld-UB435-Q and a much older Happauge "Nine 80" (editor won't let me type it out.) Both work (though neither were "detected" during setup.)

BTW: v2004 is A NIGHTMARE! I had to get rid of it and go back to version "Nineteen 03" ([b]why can't I type nine's in this forum, even with Smiles & BBCode disabled???[/b]) because I was having too many problems (one of which was TV playback.)

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#29

Post by AFelectrngineer » Sat Aug 15, 2020 5:10 pm

@ Mugsy (comment 28 above)
Thanks for sharing your insight. I was able to get an OverTheAir tuner (Avermedia- AVerTV Hybrid Ultra USB) that works with WMC on Win 10 v2004 using driver M039 (Vista/7). OTA digital channels are crystal clear.
Installation was pretty straight forward except for a wrinkle with PlayReady not updating.

- SOLVE the PlayReady not updating by STOPPING the "Windows Media Center Receiver Service" found in Control Panel / All Control Panel Items / Administrative Tools (NOTE: WMC can't be running when stopping the WMC Receiver Service)
- WMC Receiver Service did "hang" and time out while attempting to stop. This was SOLVED by reboot and then again STOPPING WMC Receiver Service.
- Next go to C/ProgramData/Microsoft/PlayReady and locate file "mspr.hds" and rename to something like "A-mspr.hds." (NOTE: technodevotee batch file "reset_playready" simply removes file "mspr.hds.")
- Run WMC Set Up TV Signal again. It does find the OTA USB Tuner and goes through the setup process but fails at Update PlayReady. SOLVED by closing WMC. Next follow ALL steps above to STOP WMC Receiver Service, rename "mspr.hds."
- Relaunch WMC, go to Settings, TV Signal and this time just select "Update PlayReady." PlayReady will update and everything will now work perfectly as intended. Exit Settings and ENJOY. Oh Happy DAY!

However, my primary tuner used in my Win 8.1 Pro setup is the Ceton InfiniTV 6 ETH (network attached 6 tuner device) that uses a CableCard supplied by my cable provider (Spectrum @ about $5/month). WMC configured to use CableCard can record COPY PROTECTED TV signal over CABLE (awesome feature exclusive to WMC with embedded Digital Rights Management by Cable Labs, ie "Digital Cable Advisor"). I've received an email from Windows 10 Media Center Community claiming CableCard Tuner(s) will not work on any Win 10 version after Nov 15, 2015 update. I did find a YouTube of a fellow who was able to get Ceton InfiniTv 6 working by using a Win 7 Ceton Installer pkg. He modified the MSI installer pkg using program called ORCA. Everything worked except he could not get PlayReady to update. Since I have found the method to get PlayReady running perfectly, I may be able to combine with his MSI installer modification and if I achieve success, I will post steps for solution. It would be AWESOME if CableCard folks could be supported for WMC on Windows 10!

FOOTNOTE: All of my Copy Protected recordings on my Win 8.1 machine can be played on this Win 10 machine, now with WMC, as long as I use the Win 8.1 machine running as the source on my home network.

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#30

Post by AFelectrngineer » Sat Aug 15, 2020 7:49 pm

OTHER POSSIBILITIES:

Given that my Win 8.1 PC with WMC can essentially act as a MEDIA SERVER for my Win 10 machine with WMC, it might be possible to set up a very basic Win 7 machine with the Ceton InfiniTV 6 ETH network Tuner device as the interface to the CableCard and cable company Copy Protected broadcast(s). In Win 7, Ceton set up ALL 6 Tuners on you "primary" PC with each Tuner available/assignable in network availability to the home network system of connected PCs and each of the Tuners could be individually or several of the 6 Tuners dedicated to a particular WMC machine on Win 7 or 8. Just for the sake of experiment, I might try this in the near future and see if Win 10 v2004 can "see" the available Ceton Tuner(s) on the network. I've seen others have set up Win 7 Virtual Machine on their Win 10 PC, but that seems overly complex.

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#31

Post by Mugsy » Sat Aug 15, 2020 9:08 pm

Interesting info. When I was researching fixing my tuner trouble, I came across a LOT of posts all describing the same problem as me except they were all using "Cable box" tuners while I only had a simple (old) USB tuner.

I know Happauge makes a x1 card with *four* tuners on it, but I've never seen a box with 6. Interesting (though I've never needed more than three.)

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#32

Post by AFelectrngineer » Sat Aug 15, 2020 9:55 pm

Ceton Corp. was definitely a "cut above" type product and they were solely in business for Windows Media Center HTPC. When Microsoft dropped WMC in Windows 10, Ceton Corp. closed their doors. I still have working hardware and all the final updated drivers and install programs. The InfiniTV 6 ETH was top of the line in its day. My cable company has no clue about the device and surely I get a bargain price on the CableCard for monthly service since I don't have to use their "BOX." The FTC mandated cable companies had to supply/support CableCard years ago to prevent monopoly practices. My Windows 8.1 Pro with WMC machine has until 2023 before EOL support. I'm still enjoying as long as I can!

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#33

Post by Rob Geebivi » Wed Aug 19, 2020 4:39 pm

Hello!

I'm a fast-learner, but I'm trying to setup a CableCard connection into WMC on Win10 for the first time and am having some difficulties.
I've done both ATSC and ClearQAM channels at my old place on a Happauge WinTV-quadHD that worked splendid (in WMC on Win10 with EPG123/SchedulesDirect) for over a year. I've moved to a new place, and my only option now is a CableCard. I got a $20 Ceton PCIe InfiniTV 4 off of eBay earlier this week to set it up, thinking it can't be that hard, right?.... :oops:
Right now, I can't find a way to get WMC to recognize the tuners in the infiniTV. Upon realizing now that it's a network-based tuner and that network tuning might not work on Win10 (can anyone confirm or deny that?) I was worried hope might be lost... Until:

It appears like AFlectrngineer here is trying to do what I'm trying to do, just with an InfiniTV 6 instead of a 4! (It also seems you got it working on Win 8.1 just fine--do you have to do any network-based tuning to do that, or is it directly reading the hardware? I apologize if my questions are very 'newbie.' Please guide me correctly!) With that, let me know if you have the link to the YouTube video! I would love to try experimenting around a little myself--I really hope we can get this working on Win10. :D

Let me know if you've made any progress, hit any rough patches, or if I should install/upgrade/downgrade anything before continuing to troubleshoot. Current installation:
* Win10 v1909
* WMC v6.3.9600.16384
* EPG123 v.1.3.10
* Ceton InfiniTV Driver v1.0.2.4
* InfiniTV Firmware v1.1.8.2
* Ceton Diagnostic Tool v13.6.3.1088
* Digital Cable Advisor

Lastly, if anyone has some step-by-step directions to start for how to go about getting WMC to recognize the InfiniTV tuners, please advise.

Thanks much!
Rob Geebivi

PS: I have an old PC that runs Win 8.1 that I could probably setup and use if we hit an absolute road block, but I'd much rather troubleshoot and get this working on Win10 if at all possible :)

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#34

Post by AFelectrngineer » Wed Aug 19, 2020 5:29 pm

@ Rob Greebivi...

I have not been successful at getting the Ceton InfiniTV 6 ETH Tuner with M-type CableCard to work on Windows 10 v2004 (most recent version). Thus far all my research seems to point to using a VERY early version of W 10 (v1511) that works with CableCard tuners. The YouTube video I found was from a fellow that posted in April 2016 ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DoOb_-wlJuk ). His attempt to get Ceton CableCard tuner to work may have been using the above referenced W 10 v1511 (or earlier).

I also tried modifying the W10 registry to match the Win 8.1 registry for DRM (Digital Rights Management) but Win 10 detected and DEMANDED immediate restart to fix "corrupt" files. The changes MS made to DRM in Windows 10 versions NEWER than v1511 seems to be the culprit that prevents CableCard from being recognized by current W 10.

At present, I am still using Ceton InfiniTV 6 ETH on my Win 8.1 Pro machine to do all Copy Protected CableCard recording. I can watch ALL recorded material on the W 10 v2004 machine. However, to do LIVE TV on Win 10 PC, I am only able to use a USB OTA ATSC tuner. I plan to add a Clear QAM tuner such as you mentioned above (Happauge WinTV-quadHD). For now, it seems best case for CableCard is to set up a Win 7/8/8.1 machine to act as a media server for all your networked PCs.

Please post if you have success with Ceton CablCard tuner on W 10 version later than 1511.
AFelectrngineer

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#35

Post by Rob Geebivi » Wed Aug 19, 2020 6:45 pm

To confirm: Your problem on the win10 machine is that after doing the InfiniTV setup and WMC closes/reopens, WMC TV Setup does not recognize the tuners, correct?
For me, it doesn't find the tuners; specifically, upon a manual selection of "Cable" and "No" (set-top box), the only Digital Cable option is ClearQAM not CableCARD.

Also, for your Win 8.1 Pro machine, do you follow this same setup process and then you just get the magic ability to select "Digital Cable (CableCARD)" ? Or is there a different process than what was shown in the video?

I may try just setting up a VM with an early Win10 build or Win7, but I'll keep ya posted :) . Could you elaborate more on why/what lead you to try and adjust the registry re: DRM on Win10? I'm curious to keep trying other things myself, and I'd love to know what others have tried so far.

Thanks again, and I'll certainly keep ya posted!
Rob Geebivi

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#36

Post by AFelectrngineer » Wed Aug 19, 2020 7:48 pm

Correct - WMC does NOT see the Ceton CableCard Tuner in Win 10 v2004 - same result whether WMC auto-detect or manual configuration. However, Ceton DOES show up in Device Manager. WMC WILL run on Win 10 v2004, just NOT CableCard tuners.

Win 8.1 with WMC installation for Ceton is straight forward. Install the DRIVER/Diagnostic package (ceton_infinitv_setup_w8_13_06_03_1088) and run WMC setup by first running Digital Cable Advisor, then WMC setup for TV Signal. Follow prompts. If you don't see Digital Cable Advisor in the WMC Extras Library, you'll need to download and install it.

What led me to REGISTRY for DRM... There are plenty of posts around the internet that are in agreement that CableCard doesn't work in Win 10 beyond v1511 due to Microsoft DRM changes. I did a side-by-side compare between my Win 8.1 and Win 10 machines. There are several REGISTRY entries that aren't present in Win 10, for example the KEY "MCEWMDRMNDBridge." See that this REGISTRY KEY includes ...DRM... As stated previously, when I added the missing REGISTRY KEY (and subs) and also installing the missing files the KEY references in the proper file directory, Windows 10 security detected the change(s) and required restart.

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#37

Post by StinkyImp » Thu Aug 20, 2020 4:58 pm

Rob Geebivi wrote:
Wed Aug 19, 2020 6:45 pm
...I'd love to know what others have tried so far.
My two cents...

I have two Windows 10 machines that I use for production/personal stuff that I keep updated.

I bought a cheap small form factor Windows 7 machine to use for my HTPC (with EPG123). I was able to find a Dell Optiplex 3010 SFF with Windows 7 Pro for around $100 that I've been using for a number of years. It's fairly unobtrusive in my entertainment center.

It looks like they're inching up in price now.

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